Cool, George. Kind of like "we pooped in our pants too, but it doesn't smell as bad as theirs."
ok, George, I agree that that might help win an election.
But would it bother you to know that you enabled the State to take 10% when you could have saved me 3%?Isn't it possible to campaign, explaining that as part of the minority you slowed the flood and given the opportunity you will build a dam?[ 06-12-2003: Message edited by: Keith ]
besides, compromise is the frog in the hot water. Eventually, you are cooked and the public will not and does not remember your mitigating the disaster, they just know you voted to raise our taxes.
George, you are assuming that the majority will in fact be won. So far, that has not happened. If their had been no compromises in recent years, our tax would be somewhere around 60% by now.The long view is good, but only if grounded in current reality.As for the frog in hot water... can we lose that silly illustration.. please?If the public does not understand "mitigating the disaster", maybe a lesson in communication is order for the campaigning individual.
Keith, get real. The state is run by one party. Every person in the state KNOWS we are the highest taxed state in the country. They know their incomes are pitiful and they know companies are leaving the state. We do not have a communication problem, we have the dual problem of republican lethargy (as in they suspect nothing they do or say will change anything. An attitude caused by our go along to get along elected reps) and the problem of special interests that all vote democrat as only the dems will fill their grasping little hand with the goodies extracted from our lethargic republican base.We didn't get to be a nanny state overnight. It took decades of compromise to get us here. Now that we have arrived, just like it is necessary for the voters to realize who has brought maine to the brink of economic disaster, it is incumbant on the part of republicans to look at the tactics that got us to permanent minority status.We dug our own graves one compromise at a time.As Einstein said, insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.We tried compromise...
Is it your position that the 97 mile per hour train to hell is preferable to the 99 mile per hour train to hell?
Is it your contention that, after years of refining the art of compromise, large groups of people will suddenly discover their spines?
If it's tough to tell the R's from the D's, the voters will have no reason to give the R's a majority. Ever.
George...Your points above are excellent on the longer view. If the GOP adopted that strategy, we would be looking at a 30 year run in Augusta.All of this compromising has just assured the Demos another two years, at least.Voters, as wonderful and well-intentioned as they are, are not focused on politics like we are. Connecting the dots...remembering crap like the Daggett-Youngblood issue...causes and effects of State budget issues...are a lot to expect from people who really focus on this stuff once every two years.
However you wish to define it, the most salient point made here is that one thing is clear...doing what we've been doing doesn't work.And being encouraged to do it by Democrats only makes it that much more embarrassing and fatalistic.
Ok, you asked, why stay in Maine? I'll answer that question as a former resident.Why I left:
1. My family was too far away, but ignoring that...
2. Running a business is a pain in Maine. Spoken from experience, I might add. The big qualification for a business person in Maine seems to me to be more an appetite for bureaucracy less than skill in one's business or taste for risk. I might also add that health insurance is crazy expensive, because the state keeps running companies out with excessive regulation.
3. The state legislature wasn't satisfied with the large chunk of my earings that they took already. Legislators were busy cooking up plans to tax new toilets (Rep. Lemoine from OOB had this great idea) or socialized medicine or property taxes on business equipment. Wait, that last one is already going on in Maine.
4. Job prospects that actually paid bills were dismal. The notion of part-time at Shaw's or the local video store wasn't too exciting for me.Why I might have stayed:
1. Lots of properly scaled towns to live in. You can't appreciate this until you've lived somewhere that isn't. There is something appealing about the scale of towns in Maine. Saco, for instance, has lots of housing within easy walking distance of places one might need to go regularly--banks, grocery stores, drug stores, post offices. My sister, on the other hand, has to drive nearly everywhere she goes, though she lives within a half-mile of such destinations. Her house is locked in a subdivision bounded by four-lane roads too dangerous for her to cross with her young children.
2. There is a sense of belonging you can have in Maine, because the towns are smaller. You have the opportunity to know your fellow residents in town, if you want to take it. But that's another issue.
3. Its historic and charming. Schaumburg, Illinois or Mequon, Wisconsin is neither.
4. The people in Maine, for the most part, are decent and hard-working sorts you would want for neighbors.
5. Better shipping rates from Johnny's Select Seeds. But that's pretty personal to me, eh?
6. Winter. Its good for you.Best of luck changing the stripes on the tiger named State Government.That said, I think I'll stay put in Upper Michigan. Close to family, and like Maine on counts 1, 2, 4 and 6. That and da lake doesn't have a low tide, eh.[ 06-13-2003: Message edited by: Cranky Pete ]
Luv it. How are the black flies and noseeums there?
I don't know that I will have time to spend on this today, but I do have a couple of thoughts...1. You people need some new cliches. The frog in the water, pooping your pants and the train to hell are pretty well worn out. I must say though, that if I was "on a train to hell", I would prefer 97 mph as oppossed to 99mph. That would give me a little more time to find a way off.2. You spend more time thinking about winning elections that doing what can be done after the vote. Ironic that among those with all the advice on winning elections, there are so few who actually have.3. Just for the record, I am firmly convinced that there is too much compromise in Augusta. I am not convinced that it is from lack of backbone, however. Well, ok, with some it is. I suspect it is more from trying to do the best one can in a difficult position.4. This thread was about reasons for voting republican. I will continue to do so because I have watched some of the legislative process and believe that most of the republicans are trying to do the right things. I agree with them far more often than I disagree. And the alternative is sickening.I have to go to work now. The democrats are depending upon my paycheck.
Keith:Where do "turd in the punchbowl,", "scheist en die hosen," and "superheating amphibians" rank on your overworn scale?
Well, Keith. Nice shot. At least some of us try. It was might lonely running as a Republican in Lewiston. But there was a few of us that tried.I found out about the defintion of 'party' when I saw Michaud's throng of volunteers massing in Lewiston. Where were the R's??? And they were asked.
I understand that you tried and that there are places where a republican has enormous obstacles to overcome. I was thinking that in spite of all the confident assertions (how is that for being nice?) spread throughout these threads, not many elections are being won.
I admit to being stuck on a simple view of elections. If I share the view of enough voters yet don't get elected, then my message must not be clear. If I don't share the views of enough voters, then the burden is on me to convert them.
For Heaven's sake, Mildrid, you said something nice to a Libertarian. That Cranky Pete was a Maine LP member who volunteered, donated money and even ran for State House. What ails you?
Nothing, thank you, Markie Markie, Barkie, Barkie.And I owe you no recitation of my credentials. Nor will I tell you how big mine are so you can tell me how yours are bigger. Do you walk around town flipping the old salsicci out every chance you get to see if you are a "better man" than the other guy? You seem to be obsessed with it. Most of us on this site understand the roots of your self-esteem deficiency and your compulsive need to self-stroke, so we won't spend time on that today. You should just line your room with mirrors on all walls, and make a tape of you praising you.Getting a name on a ballot is not some incredibly difficult challenge; and it's all the less courageous when it's known there is a snowball's chance of winning.A guy who owned a bar in the town where I was born ran for President several times in the 50s. Beer sales rose accordingly. At least his campaigns had a measurable result.
Take a pill or something Millie. It's just a joke.But thanks for displaying exactly what you accuse me of.Oh and that reminds me. In your pants-peeing excitement to be invited to a dinner with Mitt Romney (that big hunk of a handsome man!) I wasn't sure which Mitt Romney you were refering to.Is it the same Mitt Romney who spoke against and worked against and can be credited with causing the Libertarian Party referendum question that would have ELIMINATED the Massachusetts income tax to fail by 2.5 percentage points? Do you mean that Mitt Romney?Is it the same Mitt Romney who has submitted and approved a budget that is LARGER than Cellucci's budget? Do you mean that Mitt Romney?Is it the Mitt Romney who swore to not increase taxes, but who increased fees instead?Do you mean that Mitt Romney?Do you mean Mitt Romney, the REPUBLICAN?If so, then by all means, you two deserve each other. But I have it on good authority that he doesn't like people salivating on him. So don't get too close.Too bad for you that you can't deal with my trenchant humor and ruthless insults. Thank you for telling me in so many words that I annoy you, however. You've made my day.
Cranky Pete makes the best point of all on this thread:Why vote Republican when you can vote with your feet?
I will give you that for "one of the reasons", but tell me the other reasons for the message being unclear.
Keith...Your simple view of elections is accepted. I think there is one more parameter...the disconnect between the feeling one way (conservative) but voting (socialist) Democrat. Voter inertia, I might call it.
Markey-barkey: get a grip. You seem awful excited about the gala; I'm sure not. I'd much rather go to a Greenie SUV barbecue.I'm sure the gala brigade will gladly take your money if you want to show up and steal the spotlight from the lesser known glitterati.Just try to keep your zipper up, OK? And while you're at it, provide us all a list of every donation and every volunteer activity of yours so we can judge which successes you are responsible for, since you are so humbly proud of everything you do.When are you going to move to Mass and start As Massatoothetts Grows? You seem to have your hands on what's going on down there.
(((((By George you've got it)))))
OK.. I have it...
It is smart to vote republican because in spite of all the failures along the way, they are still our best realistic chance to improve things in Maine.
However voting alone will not do much. We need to call upon republicans to stand firm upon republican principles and then STAND WITH THEM. We have to help them get elected and then help them lobby, etc.
There is no room for spectators if we are going to be serious. We might even have to go beyond AMG.
Millie, you just don't understand how to beat me at this game. I keep toying with you and you post your comebacks, but they are so inept... a remnant beating of my glaciated heart has prompted me to help you out, I feel so bad for you and your inherent sad-sackness.Alright, here is how to beat me. Now this is your BIG CHANCE, so don't blow it. And yes, you can enlist your cheerleader Mattson on this.You can shut me up by listing all the wonderfulness of Republican Governor Mitt Romney.That's all you have to do. You do that and I am beaten.Please give us something more than, "Well, he's better than Shannon O'Brien!!!".Shall we hear Mattson's rallying cry of "Let's Roll!!" on this project?Think of it, you shut me up and you get to bring up my defeat again and again and again.All you have to do is prove me wrong. How difficult can that be?Here's the thing. It does no good to point out again and again that I'm a pain in the butt, that I'm arrogant, that I'm a member of a tiny group, that I've been on the losing side in three elections, two referenda and one court case. Hell, I can tell you that!Tell me something I DON'T know!
Here's 3 things:1: you can't read, in the broader sense
2: all but a few people in Maine could really care less about Mitt Romney. The only reason you care is because a lippertarian was involved in the election
3: your status as a loser goes far beyond the enumerated itemsOK, make it one more:4: the only poster on AMG who has less impact than me is you
We will all be enthralled to understand what is meant by reading "in the broader sense". Perhaps you can start writing things that MAKE sense.What do I care if Maine people are too provincial to take an interest in the politics of THE MOST POPULOUS AND MOST IMPORTANT STATE IN NEW ENGLAND?The fact is, he is the Governor of Massachusetts, he is a leading Light (or is that spelled lite?) of your precious Republican Party, and he is important enough to be the guest at some R Party shindig whose organizers have at least enough sense to include Mr. Cianchette. I take an interest in him only because he is a textbook example of the anemia and counter productiveness (hell, let's just call it DESTRUCTIVENESS) of the political movement you and the vast number of AMG posters defend.So I like him immensely. He makes my burden so much lighter. As do you, my darling.And I don't post on AMG to please anyone else, so why do I care if I'm popular? I've long ago given up on persuading anyone to change (you see Millie, there was an AMG before you came along. And there were lots and lots of Libertarians posting every day. Like 12 or 13 of us. And except for Snowman, we were all nice and positive and constructive and invitational. And it did no good. You conservatives are just that. CONSERVATIVE. Which means you are inflexible, habitual, reflexive, unchanging. So most of us just gave up discussing things with you)So now I just post to please myself and the people who tell me they enjoy my writing. I make my jokes and many people have a good laugh at your expense, myself included.No one ever proves me wrong. Oh, I get hissy fits from time to time, which I just ADORE! And I get ignored plenty, but what do I care about that?I win by default and enjoy it!
Now Mille, don't make empty accusations. If you have more evidence of me being a loser, open up!Spill the beans! It sounds like you have some good dirt. Tell us all. If it's true stuff, I'll admit it.I'm the self-described Intrepid Defender of Truth, right?You need to list all the things you've heard at the country club about how awful I am and why the checked-pants fat asses in the R Party can't stand me.See, you say that you are the second least influential poster. This is how you raise your AMG status!Good grief, do I have to explain everything to you?
Scott, ...and the alternative is?
No you won't, because you can't.Keep on "pleasing yourself;" I was pretty sure that was what you were doing. But maybe you should try pictures instead of writing; you need so much less imagination to reach the peak. I'll give you this: you type pretty good for only using one hand.OH MY GOD THE MOST IMPORTANT STATE IN NEW ENGLAND OR WHATEVER! I'm all a-twitter! Surely they want you!And trust me, no-one has a laugh "at my expense." That can only happen if I allow it, and since I don't take myself seriously, anyone else laughing cannot be "at my expense."Ah yes...Snowman....and the rest. You all won so many converts. What's the old saying...I'd rather be lucky than right?If you ever decide to stop posting on AMG, we'll simply replace you with a cement mixer full of rocks, and no-one will know the difference. Except for Snowman, who will find the new you more intelligent.
Keith - Good for you. You arrived at the answer to your own question.Now as for AMG'ers being talkers and not doers? First, AMG is supposed to be a place for discussion. That's always been true. So for anyone to criticize a site for doing what it's supposed to do makes no sense.I know of some, not all, [i]action[/i] taken - and being taken - by AMGers. To criticize AMGers as all talk, no action, is just wrong.Finally, I don't think there's any question that Maine's political scene is better for the contributions -- even if it's just talking (a.k.a. sharing ideas) -- freely given by the many, many talented people who use AMG.skf