A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

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Debi Davis
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A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

quote:Originally posted by Peter Zaimes:
[b]Bob,What I meant, and should have said, was that healthcare insurance in Maine is an intractable morass of sludge. I apologize for not having been more precise. Certainly, healthcare delivery in not the issue here.Other than than that, I agree with you that the "crisis could have been solved." However, it wasn't. So now stand back and see how reform works as nobody has cared to do anything about it up to this point. I know that the Republicans would prefer to do nothing but that is not acceptable anymore.[/b]

Peter,
May I ask what position you hold in the "Do Something Even If It's Wrong Club"?

Debi Davis
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A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

SLOW DOWN! An extremely accelerated effort is being made to change the entire health care industry in this state. As a Mainer, I am concerned that with such a pace, there will be some parts that are missed for discussion or study. Doesn't this deserve your detailed attention that can only come with thorough study over time? There are too many parts to this equation to rush them through an incomplete process. I believe that you will be doing a diservice to the people of Maine if you do not take the time necessary to completely examine and ponder the ramifications of this undertaking.Mainers are not afraid of change, but we insist that our leaders use care and prudence in considering such an incredible plan. We expect the plan to be clear and concise BEFORE it is implemented, not after. We are also against funding an effort that is not yet thought through and agreed upon by all affected economies. We are watching you. We want you to slow down and consider this effort carefully. Take all the time necessary to contemplate every aspect, seek out any information available to you and do it in YOUR time frame. Remember, every one of you work for the people of Maine, not the Governor's office.Sincerely,
Debi A. Davis
Raymond, Maine

Melvin Udall
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Debi is really saying let's practice "ready, aim, fire", instead of the current "ready, fire, aim" approach.

Jean Carbonneau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Debi: I saw this in a old "Ideas on Liberty" magazine, that I think speaks volumes on the current "crisis" in paying for health care.Imagine the following dialog:Smith (interested in auto insurance) I'm looking for some good auto insurance coverage.Jones: (an auto insurance salesman) You've come to the right place.S: Would your insurance cover me if I had an auto crash?J: Certainly our insurance covers auto accidents.S: (blushing) Well, I must admit I had an auto accident once, but that was several years ago. I'm more mature now, and take precautions. Now, I only have planned auto crashes.J: I'm sorry?S: Yes, I think auto crashes are to important to take likely. I plan all of them carefully. No auto "accidents" for me. But of course I want insurance coverage.J: You say you PLAN ON having auto crashes in the future?S: Yes, at least two in the next 5 to 10 years. Possibly three.J: And you want us to insure you for them?S: You said you sold insurance, right?J: Well, yes ... but typcially people insure to avoid large expenses from unexpected circumstances. If you're planning to have auto crashes, why not set aside a fund to pay for them?S: Well, that's silly. If I did that, auto crashes would be more expensive for me. If I have insurance, I'll be able to take advantage of group rates. As you know, some people don't have any auto crashes. Some, I believe even have autos but never drive, making crashes extremely unlikely (though why they'd have the equipment and never use it, I certainly don't understand). I'll be able to take advantage of their driving records in a group policy, lowering my costs. J: And raising theirs...S: Well, they were the ones to decide not to have auto crashes. If they choose to have auto crashes in the future, your company will pay for them, too.J: That just raises the cost of auto insurance for everyone.S: Well, if the government didn't think your paying for my planned auto crashes was good public policy, they wouldn't have mandated that planned auto crashes be covered by all auto insurance policies.Everyone see that Smith's arguement is jsut crazy - economically foolish, and morally obtuse. Amazing that when you change "auto crash" to "pregnancy" and "auto insurance" to "health insurance," everyone thinks it makes perfect sense.The author of this dialog is Ross Levatter, and he is a physician in Wisconsin.[ 06-09-2003: Message edited by: Jean Carbonneau ]

mirgliP
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Jean,Is your solution to tax pregnant women? Or to institute mandatory contraception as a condition of coverage? (chastity belts only for the right wingers of course)Or maybe since some auto insurers won't cover me if I own a radar detector we should have an exclusion for people with uterus'. :eek: But then again, we all know that pregnancy can be caused by men thinking with the wrong head, so maybe [b]that[/b] should be removed. :eek:

Peter Zaimes
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Deb,I think we have had enough time to "contemplate." I understand that the Republicans prefer to do nothing and leave us to flounder in the intractable morass of sludge that is the healthcare system that we are stuck with here in the State of Maine.The point is that you have already had a long time to "contemplate' it. Now is the time for action and you do not like it. Soemetning is now being done about it and you cannot stop it. Right or wrong, "something" is being done. You had your chance, you did nothing. Hang on and enjoy the ride! :p

Jean Carbonneau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

No Randy. I think the author's point here is that we should be treating health insurance on the same basis as auto and life and homeowners insurance etc.Geez, take a break!!!

Bob Stone
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Peter...As a former trustee of one of Maine's larger health care systems, I take offense at your characterization of Maine's health care system as an "intractable morass of sludge". I have worked with management, staff and physicians for a number of years as they strived to deliver the best health care possible. Patient after patient reported that they were given outstanding care in survey after survey.Maine's health care system is excellent. Maine has a health care INSURANCE crisis, something that is being kept obfuscated by Baldacci and his socialist minions. This crisis could be solved by legislation other than "Dirigo Health", but eliminating guaranteed issue, community ratings and mandate after legislative mandate does not meet the needs of our socialist Governor to put union 'cheeks in the seats' in the Augusta area.[ 06-09-2003: Message edited by: Bob Stone ]

mirgliP
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

quote:I think the author's point here is that we should be treating health insurance on the same basis as auto and life and homeowners insurance etc.

And mine is that access to health care is a different issue than whether you can own that Corvette or live in a flood zone.

Peter Zaimes
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Bob,What I meant, and should have said, was that healthcare insurance in Maine is an intractable morass of sludge. I apologize for not having been more precise. Certainly, healthcare delivery in not the issue here.Other than than that, I agree with you that the "crisis could have been solved." However, it wasn't. So now stand back and see how reform works as nobody has cared to do anything about it up to this point. I know that the Republicans would prefer to do nothing but that is not acceptable anymore.

Kevin Lamoreau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Jean,I don't think people plan on getting sick so their health insurance can cover them (although life insurance can be a different story). I also don't think most people plan on getting pregnant so welfare can help them out. Yes, I'm sure in the minds of some people they do expect they might need health insurance coverage and/or financial assistance to care for their (possibly unplanned for) children, and expect the state to help with that to some degree. And I'm also sure that many people who cannot afford to support children feel eisier when they have unprotected sex if they think that if they (or often just she) can't support their child on their own that the government will help with their expenses. Probably some people would be less worried about looking for a job that provided health care coverage if they thought the state would help them out if it turned out they needed long term health care expensive prescription drugs (either through negotiating for lower prices like in the Pingree drug bill or providing assistance in paying for it, like in Medicare or Medicaid). I don't think that just because people expect government assistance means the government should leave them out to dry. There's a point that you gotta say, "Yeah, he/she was being manipulative, expecting us to help, but we still can't not help him/her". I know there's charity, but it may not be able to cover all of the gaps between what people can pay for and what people need. And should people really have to rely on charity (or government assistance, for that matter) to pay for prescription drugs when they sell in Europe for prices they could more easily afford? (They may still need charity or government assistance, but they'd need less of than they would with prices as they are now, leaving charities or government able to help other people more, or the government could even afford to - my liberal mind shrieks to think it - tax people less.) I know Dirigo touches on a lot more than the cost of prescription drugs, but I was attacking a conservative free market ideology on prescription drugs (the state shouldn't be allowed to negotiate for lower prices because it's either unconstitutional or messes with supply-demand equilibrium, or both) that I see as part of the reason some people oppose Dirigo health, even though some of them might keep those type of arguments quiet in public because they believe that even if they is right, which I don't think they are, that the people don't agree with it.Even if you don't agree with my above points (and you can feel free to state your disagreements with those, although being a slimy liberal I might let it go without countering or surrendering if I feel I'm loosing the argument), I think it's unfair to suggest that any more than a small percentage of people hoping for government assistance actually want to need it - they may expect they might and don't want to work so they won't need it, but that is different (although you might think it's just as bad). I'm going to stop writing now, but I wish you all a great evening and a great day tomorrow.P.S. to Scott (the editor) - thanks for having this forum so I can rant and rave and make people dizzy (and also trade ideas and broaden my perspective and stuff like that).Sincerely,Kevin Lamoreau

Bob Stone
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Peter...Thanks for your response. I think the problem wasn't solved because the political will wasn't there amongst many Democrats. The Dems have controlled things up there for many, many years.

Jean Carbonneau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

What is it with people on this forum. Geez!!Randy and K-Dog, can you explain to me that people were dying off because they couldn't get healthcare before the "government" helped out?Let me explain that well before the government interferred in the marketplace, private insurance was available, and people could buy coverage that suited their individual needs. Most people paid for doctor's visits out of pocket, and even doctors would make "housecalls", so that patients didn't have to wait in offices.Fraternal organizations offered members low cost health insurance that tailored to their needs, not some government bureaucrats dictums. When will you ever understand that government interference is the main cause of the problem we have in the cost of health insurance. Also, the marketplace is trying to address the needs of paying for healthcare. A doctor in Washington state has devised a program called "simplecare", where patients pays a fee based on the time spent in the office. No insurance claims, no third party involved, and the patients get the care they need at reasonable prices. Check out their website.[url=http://www.simplecare.com]www.simplecare.com[/url] . Notice that they haven't been able to sign up any doctors in Maine yet. What a shame. K-Dog, do you feel that people have the right to health care? If so, why!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jean Carbonneau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Hatchcar is still here, just under his real name!!

Peter Zaimes
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Jean,You are not paying attention. There is [b]one[/b] doctor signed up in Maine. ;) H Gary Parker, MD, PA
Orthopedics
358 Broadway, Ste 201
Bangor, ME04401

[url=http://www.mainebones.com]www.mainebones.com[/url]If you break a leg trying to get there, he can set it for you.

Jean Carbonneau
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

He must have just signed up recently. I check the site from time to time, and everytime I've checked, there was no one.Maybe they'll be more to sign up so that people can get care at affordable prices.

Doug Thomas
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Debi, Good letter, and your absolutely right, if the Maine Legislature is going to take over 1/6 of the economy of this state they need to understand what they're doing. If it's not done right all of us are going to pay dearly.
Kevin, I'm willing to help those who need help, but more and more I'm meeting people who won't work. They have one health problem or another that prevents them from working, but it sure doesn't prevent them from doing the things they want to do.

There's a pretty simple formula for success in America.Stay in school and get an education.Find a job and keep it.Get married and stay married.Don't spend more than you earn.If those principles were taught instead of "if it feels good do it" our problems, even health care, would be a lot smaller.

Bob Stone
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

George..."threeputt" is now just a footnote in cyber history....floating out there in the ether.He was last spotted on the other side of the Rubicon, waving 'so long' to our train, the "Monkey Business II" with John Elias "I Won't Raise Taxes (Much)" Baldacci at the controls and Trish Riley shoveling in the coal.Bob[ 06-10-2003: Message edited by: Bob Stone ]

Bob Stone
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Dirigo Health won UNANIMOUS committee approval last night.

Peter Zaimes
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Great news!!

Bob Stone
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

Time will tell...

James
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

doom, doom, doom doom

Concerned
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Re: A concerned citizen's plea to all Legislators.....

wow..even Glynn and Turner? What is happening to the GOP in Maine?[ 06-10-2003: Message edited by: Concerned ]

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